Andy Mcnab
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>>By Lethe (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 10:24)
Anyway, I gather from his other books that he does have emotions and a soul.
But I agree with the point of view that Nick is lacking in emotions in DW, and I think it's a big loss. I did not like the very long description of Suzy and Nick breaking into the house, which seemed to take up most part of the book. I hope McNab will let Nick remain a bit of a "treehugger" as he calls it, for that is what makes the character attractive to me.
This is all meant to be constructive criticism, from an admiring fan of course.
>>By Lethe (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 10:33)
Hey guys and gals, calm down, we don't want any more AM fans (or not) banned from tbe board, do we!? Think I may have come close, yesterday, to getting kicked. Instead I got away with mere knuckle rap for posting the AM thisislondon live-chat transcript - less than 60 sec free air miles...;-)
Indeed to goodness, Capt BG was quick off the mark smartly followed by deputy dude AIB waving punishment hat during full lecture as to why it's against the rules to post copy-pasted material ;-) <<Won't wear it, won't wear it.>> ;-) Not that we haven't posted transcripts in the past, but what the hell if goal posts are moved, just means we'll have to run like hell with the ball to the touchlines, eh, all you rugby fans.
Of course, "The Mirror Piers" would have posted/published and be damned, but then again, as AM covers all legal angles to ensure rights of privilege perhaps MG was quite lenient. ;-)
Note smileys of appeasement...
Hmmm, stand-alone books. Yeah well, as a prime example Dick Francis was a master in the field of series novels - Sid Halley ex jockey turned PI.. If you read one and you had the slightest connection or wont of to the giddyups you sure wanted to collect them all. Have to say, I'd really appreciate day-time repeats of that particular TV series. In the same sense of wanting more, one could say when I purchased Crisis Four it instilled (for me) a need to read more AM books, (flashback reminder I still haven't read the ones before), but LL/LD/DW changed in style, and syntax. By that I mean Crisis Four not only had reams of laughter it also reflected a sense of wild confused abandon that is Nick Stone, I presumed, followed through from previous novels.
However, when I settled down with LL/LD it was patently clear that Nick had matured, the narration was more literary (not in the sense of literary for high-brow literati), but as though a new editor had kicked in with his/her twopenneth and stole a mark on the books. OK, so I'm probably wrong on that, and if I am then it means AM has lost his sparkle and fluid flow, hence *noticeable* repeats instead of subtle fresh application of old threads. Granted, he's had a rough time of it with Nick's love life, but when all is said and done, faithful readers are just as important as new ones.
In DW, shocking as it was for readers, personally, I felt an awful lot was missing from the book - scene takes were short and snappy, more in keeping with a script for film/TV 3 min slots and ultimate duration 2 hour max preferably 1hr 40mins, and too many scenes of breaking into houses: and in the end, thinking it just didn't gel. It was possible to read the book in 3 hrs. In that sense I can agree with Saxon on quantity of clumsy stuffing, and agree with Beth on quality of story line. What's the betting that the next two books added to DW would have made for a superb one-book read.
If you study the basic framework of writing (speaking from experience) = months to write, weeks of honing (checking for mistakes ec) then perhaps AM (hectic lifestyle/business interests) really hasn't the time to write anything more than a few threads of original work, the rest hastily gathered up in hoped for seamless garb!?
Believe me, AM does have an emotional side, and that is the thing that scares him the most - why he keeps it at bay like a slavering wolf...It's bitten him before and he doesn't want it biting him again...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 12:09)
To me those long scenes are just what I do like about his books. The fact that it feels like you are part of what’s happening. That you're looking over their shoulders and watch every move. All those little details makes it all the more real, fascinating and exciting. And very much the quality why I prefer Andy's books above others.
The flashbacks are necessary to know what he's going through and I don't think it's 'easy' to write it exactly how it was in the first book(s), that is necessary. One of the skills they learn is to look at every detail, to 'make' a film in their head, which is necessary to remain invisible, not to 'change' anything in a house or place, to avoid any surprises when things get hectic. So I think it is only logical Nick Stone's flashbacks are in detail and exactly the same - like a film.
Also make sure a 'fan' reader will be very annoyed if a flashback doesn't exactly describe what happened in a former book.
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 12:12)
Not everyone writes in the same way, Buddy.
Arthur Miller wrote "Death of a Salesman" in four weeks.
I was just wondering, how come everything you write about AM even if it's supposed to be complimentary seems like an insult?
Don't you like him or something?
>>By Lethe (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 14:17)
Lethe, I don't think Buddy is trying to or does insult AM, or his writting. What I think (and that is my opinion) is that she merely tries to go into the psicological profile of this man (that's what I try to do at least) and as she is a writer too and maybe understands the "writting profession" more than some of us, she just tries to explain these passages in his life that come back and you can read between the line is his books. Maybe I'm completely wrong, but I also think that AM can't be an easy man to handle, that is if he lets himself handle by anyone, and has some trouble with interpersonal relations too ( now did I get that right).
Anyway I found this passage in CR's book who talks about AM's behaviour quite interesting :
"After our return in the UK, Stan and I remained on close terms. Andy was a different matter. When he got back, he didn't seem to want to make contact. Several times I phoned his house in Hereford, but I always spoke to his girlfriend, and he never returned my calls. That seemed strange to me, I couldn't make out why he was being so stand-offisch. It was as if he didn't want to come around and face me.
It was inevitable that we would meet sooner or later......When I saw him, I went " Hey! and he just looked up and nodded, There was no handshake, no "Glad to see you back" or anything like that. I was dissapointed that a mate of mine could behave in that way, and I could only put it down to jealousy and the fact that I'd got away while he was caught (now I don't quite agree with that).
Thereafter, we'd talk about it if we were thrown together, but we never met for a drink to shoot the shit, To me it was pretty sad that anyone could carry on in a way so alien to the spirit of the Regiment, wich values companionship and loyalty above everything, A psichiatrist who had us all in for a talk told us that after what we'd been through togetherm we'd remain very close to each other -
and indeed hw words applied to everyone except Andy.........."
This is CR's view, I'd be interested to know what AM's view was and still is.
>>By borisette (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 14:53)
Hi Borisette,
I know something of psychology myself, and that goes for writing fiction as well.
It just seems better to me not to mix up the two.
I'm familiar with the passage you quoted (from the one book by Chris Ryan I managed to finish) and the only thing that surprises me about it is that CR is surprised by AM's behaviour, and then draws all kinds of conclusions.
It is nothing out of the ordinary for someone who has been traumatized like that to behave differently than before, to, for instance, become withdrawn.
There are even people who underwent traumatic experiences together and afterward never wanted to see each other again. This was not caused by jealousy, spite, or lack of loyalty, it was simply a reaction to the trauma.
Hi Lynn,
I also like the meticulous way in which he describes everything. It does make it very realistic and exciting
It just shouldn't take up most of the story, in my opinion.
Also, I think that Nick's "treehugging", his softer and more emotional side, is a bit lacking in DW, and I hope Am is not going to dispose of it altogether, because it is a big part of what makes Nick a real, not a flat character to me.
>>By Lethe (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 17:04)
Lethe, I prefer to be subjective (not objective), and that way I won't impart, by accident, things I know about AM, (good or bad) in a personal manner.
Please feel free to impart where exactly you feel I have insulted AM. If you see my posts as insulting, then you are looking to the negative as opposed to positive. Why is that so, is a question worth asking yourself. Is it because your subconscious sees the logic of my compliment but the conscious won't accept that a negative might indeed exist?
Absolutely Lethe, one can write the basis of a story in four weeks, sometimes a whole story materialises within hours, but the process of getting down on paper/computer - into manuscript format - is all down to how many words per minute, per hour, per day one can actually type and, the resulting word count, ie;
10,000/30,000 wds = short story.
60,000/100,000 wds = novel.
100,000/150,000 wds = blockbuster read.
Why do you think one heck of lot of published bestselling novelists employ the services of assistants? Jilly Cooper employs anything up to three people to type/edit her blockbuster manuscripts long before they even hit the editor's desk...
Borisette, so discerning. Oh absolutely, the psychological makeup of AM is a tad complicated and therefore eminently more interesting
than CR's, because CR openly says what he thinks and is, to all intents and purposes, an open book...I like that in a person, and I find people who duck and dive to be mildly infuriating.
As a psycho therapist it is far better to let a client/patient reveal at their own pace what it is they need to get off their chest, and it is not good practice to prompt and press for imformation because that is as good as interrogation. A man like AM will immediately clam up or lie through his teeth as a defensive mechanism...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 17:19)
Ha, cross-posted, Lethe.
PTSS: On that count I'm well up on coping with PTSS on a personal basis, (hubby - special ops officer) and administering therapy for Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome to others. You are right, some people do wish to cut themselves off from anything and anyone who reminds them of elements of suffering, whether physical or mental, but even then, physical and mental become part and parcel of the whole that affects the individual. I won't go into it in depth, because somewhere on this board I've already done all that to give insight to those not in the know about such things...
Looking at CR and AM as individuals, yes CR escaped but by huge amounts of guts and self determination. Yes, he as good as accused AM of being jealous that he, CR, escaped. What he was really saying was, if it had been the other way around he would have been jealous as hell if AM had made it out of Iraq he (CR) hadn't. I don't see that as a nast insulting jibe, do you, now?
Take AM, captured, huge amounts of guts in his holding out against extreme brutality and intense interrogation. OK, so he lied, he's tained to do that, and when they come out of the SAS, sometimes that old skill of lying fronts there every move on strange territory, until that is, they know who they can trust, though few people earn the kind trust AM or CR expects...
For CR, coping in the outside world is no big deal because he hasn't chosen to remain anonymous so he will inevitably accumulate more friends than perhaps AM will. That's not to say AM doesn't have friends, but of those he does they too have to exist within his anonymous existance. Do you see what I mean? They, friends, are limited in what they can say or do in respect of the Man...Some friends might say I wish I'd never met him, and that way I can't ever upset him by talking out of turn, at the same time those friends don't intentionally want to betray any secrets and that puts huge pressure on those people - mild form of torture...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 17:44)
Posting the whole interview would be a blatant copyright violation, as I've learned. So pity, but something we have to respect
"AM does have an emotional side, and that is the thing that scares him the most"
IMHO in Dark Winter Nick is more emotional than he ever was. Of course he 'hides' it well saying his food must have been bad...
And I can't remember he ever cried before...
Emotions in other books were about his physical condition, now it's clear that it's the love for Kelly.
About CR: "What he was really saying was.."
Reading the book I doubt many people judge his words as "oh, ok but what he really saying is... " That takes some knowledge of CR's personality. Most people will just take it as it's written in black and white (whether it's wise to do that at all, ever, is another discussion).
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 18:47)
Lynn, good point you put forth: "Also make sure a 'fan' reader will be very annoyed if a flashback doesn't exactly describe what happened in a former book."
But, as a fan you know what happened, and it wouldn't matter if AM rearranged a sentence or two, in fact it would make it all the more an interesting passage instead of word for word as was. No one ever retells, in reality, the same story exactly in the same word frame. Hell, I hope he doesn't have to keep reading through previous books in order to remember where he left off specific threads...
On the B&W issue: yep you're right, and we all say things we wished we hadn't - with hindsight. You know something, when Chris is really nervous he talks too much, when AM is really nervous his hands tremble...And yes, I know they were damaged, but I'm talking mental stress...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 19:11)
B&W
I do know/think CR regrets some of the things he said and the latest prints have a prologue or something to explain a couple of things I believe. But as Borisette just repeated his words.. it is obvious it is (still) read that way. .
If I'm nervous I eat too much.
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 19:19)
On a lighter note, it's been bandied about offboard that the next book will be a revenge story line.
I guess that's inevitable in some sense of the word REVENGE, but one hopes it won't be too genrefied. Mind you, I wouldn't mind reading a piece on AM sticking the barrel of a gun up George's nose. A good nappy rash for a few days before he finally pulls the trigger will be a fitting end to that piece of s***e.
Think of all the emotions that'll drag up, him being Carrie's father, and will the tree-hugging lady take it sitting down or will she put NS through the grinder...Oh lordy, lordy, what a hell of book the next could be, with a love-hate angle and another little girl to love...Too twee, huh? Absolutely...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 19:23)
Should have said Shredder on the twee twee issue...I'm glad he's supporting the recycled paper chase!!
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 19:29)
Staying with the posts talking about DW if you don’t mind…
Surprisingly, I agree with everybody! Hahaha! First off, I think DW is Andy's best fiction yet and it is now my favourite.
Re: CPA (cut, paste, assemble)
I understand being disappointed in the passages lifted verbatim from RC. Nick is reliving the trauma, yes, but I kept wishing that AM had paraphrased Nick's original experience, retaining their full clarity and impact from RC, but also making it "fresh" for readers who would obviously recognize the exact text from RC. It was similar in LL, too, with Nick reliving RC memories but not quite as blatant as in DW. I think Nick's flashbacks are critical elements in his stories; they definitely help define NS, and in some instances, exact quoting is appropriate and effective. But if AM had given a little bit more effort and reworked the RC passages rather doing straight cut & pastes, I don't think we'd be discussing the importance of Nick's flashback memories at all.
Re: Minute (by minute) Details…. (it’s all in the pronunciation!)
Personally, I especially enjoy all of AM’s descriptions of whatever, be it how a weapon operates to sweat accumulating in the facemask to the painful muscle-cramping process of climbing stairs while clearing. It is the minutia which makes me feel a part of NS’s environment and gives me a true feeling of being there, doing that – which is probably what I most relish about AM’s writing. That said, there have been times when I recognized “filler” (especially in LD), but not so with DW. I was extremely pleased with the pacing and detail DW. I felt AM struck an excellent balance between detailed descriptions and actual action.
Re: Feelings, nothing more than feelings…(oooh, do I feel a song…?)
Okay, talking only NS here, not projecting AM: Nick does not have to emote anything for the reader to know that he’s struggling to suppress inner turmoil (feelings). Nick’s tragic flaw is that he has a conscience – a dangerous handicap for someone in his line of work. His fundamental desire to do “the right thing” gives people like Lynn, the Yes Man, and George the ability to manipulate Nick. I don’t want to read how Nick is in touch with his inner child or his feminine side or his whatever blather. It’s in Nick cutting away or trying to minimize, in what he doesn’t want to look at too closely or deal with, that the weight of his guilt and pain are most poignant. Another thing we’ve discussed ad infinitum (but it’s still not stopping me!) is that betrayal of trust is so core to everything that AM writes. That said, consider what NS will be dealing with post-DW.
Re: An aside…
One thing I really liked about NS in DW – he is in more control of his own fate/decisions. Yes, he’s pressured and has to accept the assignment, but this time it’s not about money or the “or WE will kill Kelly” threat – it’s “or THEY will kill Kelly… and everyone else” so Nick consciously chooses to take the assignment, and, to me, that seemed empowering. Nick had been in a sort of “poor me, what else can I do” rut (which is surprising considering Nick’s ruthlessness when the circumstances warrant), but even as he entered DW, NS had a more positive attitude, seemingly because he was more financially secure working for George.
Re: AM writing sex scenes (oooh!)
Hmmm. Yes, well, let's see... Sarah.... Suzy.... mmmm... nevermind…. :o)
Re: Revenge
Considering all the candidates for payback, I think AM will need more than two more books. Hmmm... I like that idea!
>>By am-i-binned (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 19:50)
Contradiction, or what AIB?
You posted: "One thing I really liked about NS in DW – he is in more control of his own fate/decisions. Yes, he’s pressured and has to accept the assignment, but this time it’s not about money or the “or WE will kill Kelly” threat – it’s “or THEY will kill Kelly… and everyone else” so Nick consciously chooses to take the assignment, and, to me, that seemed empowering."
buddy: Chooses to take the assignment? He has no option in DW, unlike in previous novels where his motivation was Kelly's welfare and schooling!!! Where does the empowerment really lie...
Then you posted: "Nick had been in a sort of “poor me, what else can I do” rut (which is surprising considering Nick’s ruthlessness when the circumstances warrant), but even as he entered DW, NS had a more positive attitude, seemingly because he was more financially secure working for George."
buddy: I didn't see NS as ever in a sort of *poor me, what else can I do* rut. All mercenary work is fairly lucrative, bloody dangerous and reliant upon success of job in hand. Usually a down-payment and rest at end of mission. You'd be darn lucky to get full payment upfront. There is rarely any financial security working for covert ops on a freelance basis, and even less working for someone like George. NS is and, would be expendable at any time he gets or got a bit above himself. So he's always up against that as well -appeasing his boss while biting the bullet...
You posted: "It is the minutia which makes me feel a part of NS’s environment and gives me a true feeling of being there, doing that – which is probably what I most relish about AM’s writing."
buddy: hee hee, I got you pictured jumping off a sofa... ;-)
Sorry, DW ain't a patch on CF...
>>By buddy (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 21:33)
"Nick had been in a sort of “poor me, what else can I do” rut
I did feel a slight difference in DW too. Doing assignments 'for Kelly' to make the money for treatment has been clear in other books. And even when there was pressure, still the pressure came from 'his' side. This time it's the 'other side' who's got Kelly.
The difference between having Nick 'by the balls' and a knife through his heart. Difference between ruthless and evil.
Though the outcome might be the same in the end, I think it gave Nick a little more passion this time. Former jobs were like 'hey, it's what I'm good at - and besides I have to do it because of Kelly' Now it was 'f*ck everyone, I AM gonna do this'
Dunno if I've managed to make clear what I feel but I gave it my best shot :o)
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 22:16)
Uhm... Contradiction?
Me contradicting me? Why ask me? How would I know, but I'm guessing it's probably me contradicting good ol' Orwatt again...
Hey, Orwatt, got anything to say about this? ;o)
>>By am-i-binned (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 22:42)
Okay, while I wait to hear back from Orwatt (since it might take a while), here's something that would have been neat to know about for the chat... :o)
amibinned asks: So, AM, if there's a Young Indiana, will there be Young Nick?
http://books.guardian.co.uk/news/
articles/0,6109,1090474,00.html
"Another author making a lucrative move into children's books is Andy McNab, the former SAS serviceman turned thriller writer. With scriptwriter Robert Rigby, he is to produce four action adventure books for teenagers, beginning with Young Blood, due out from Doubleday in spring 2005. McNab's rival, Chris Ryan, has already produced several titles in a teenage series called Alpha Force. Zenith Entertainment is planning to turn the McNab novels into a television series."
>>By am-i-binned (Saturday, 22 Nov 2003 22:47)
Hi Lynn,
Maybe it's just me. Maybe I'm just imagining that Nick is different in DW emotionally. I just felt that in for instance Last Light he had much more doubts about what he was doing, was questioning himself more. I thought that was great, and I just hope AM will keep portraying him that way. I guess I always hoped that in the end Nick would "find himself". Get healed. Or something. Know what I mean? Still, I liked DW a lot. Although it made me cry.
I wonder what LB is like, haven't read it yet.
>>By Lethe (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 00:07)
The contradiction:
In pre DW, NS had every opportunity to provide for Kelly without working as a covert operator. He had the know how to do all manner of jobs that would have only put him at risk similar to military service. Had he never ventured into the covert game Kelly would never have been at risk...AM however, chose that route for his books, hence enthusiasm for this list...
In DW, there was a much greater moral dilemma than that of personal factors. He was in the game, has been in the game, and in real life greater sense of moral is evident in the trees for pulp issue, plus other things he's involved with...
If everyone on the list falls down in a faint every time AM's name is mentioned, and we all resorted to flowery prose in his favour at every turn, saying this or that is his best book ever, I can tell you he'd puke - big time!! All the books are good for differing reasons.
Gee whiz, even the review blurbs on jacket cover are the same ones used for Crisis Four!!! So who, actually, if anyone, reviewed DW as read pre sale, because the review prior to DW (hitting the bookstands) didn't really relate to the story line, it implied elements that didn't even exist.
I've asked myself: Where was most of the book set in comparison to prereview/blurb?
What did the cover suggest? For me, that America is a dangerous power force!! For other people it will be viewed from an entirely different perspective.
Anyone who watched the Big Read tonight and Joe Brand's promotion for George Orwell's 1984 might well agree with my perspective of DW's cover jacket...Wouldn't be any fun being here if everyone agreed with that sentiment, though, would it?
"Booker Prize" talk, offboard, concluded that AM wouldn't really want to be in the same league as Vanessa Feltz, Ann Widdecombe, Victoria Beckham, Jamie Oliver, surely? God, that would be like saying his books are total celeb rubbish...
I'm not getting at AM, I'm pointing at pre presentation of DW.
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 00:27)
Puke or vanity?
Who has the answer...
If it's the latter, I'll send a personalised mirror for Christmas...
Vanity says it wouldn't get smashed up.
If it's puke, I'm not holding the paper bag...
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 00:42)
The season of goodwill and all that, a few signed copies wouldn't go amiss...
http://www.giveasyouget.net/amazon/-mode-books_uk-search_type-AuthorSearch-input_string-Andy+McNab-locale-uk.html
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 01:06)
Here's the link to the official transcript from This Is London:
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/articles/
7785032?source=Evening%20Standard
Some oddly selective editing, tho -- four of our questions/comments do not identify the F Troopers who posted them... uh-oh, could dark forces be at work? :o\
>>By am-i-binned (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 07:48)
RE AIB's transcript link and dark forces at work...
Stand up *nutter* we know it's you, the offboarders that is. Gawd, you SAS techy boys do get together and cause 'such' mayhem.
What was that you said, nutter, it wasn't you it was McNab when he puked, pressed the delete. Oh, right, er that'll upset some...
Lethe, if you liked AM's honesty tree-hugging self in CF you'll like his honest approach to some Arab difficulties in LB. The Middle East situation is not B & W, but American influence since the late fifties has seemingly viewed it as such: Jews Vs Arabs. Unfortunately the whole of the Middle East is not in the Palestinian sections (concentration camps) aka Gazza Strip & West Bank...
The best part about DW (for me - getting all personal like as is the form here) was:
27pgs = 1,2, & 3 chaps concluded the Malaysian job (quote Malaysian instead of named country)....
Chaps 4-10 were US based...(couldn't see connection with Brook'y Bridge other than for US bound book market - our friends! across the pond being of a more patriot stance of S & S flying from every high point)
Chaps 11-52 UK based...(whoopy, if DW ever makes it to the big screen, and its shot in the UK, then that means work for Brit film crews, one would hope! being a tad patriot here!!)
Chaps 53-54 (more an epilogue) again touching base in US...
Wowee, "Young Blood" et al...Good oh, two little grandsons give every excuse to buy (read) and keep for when old enough ;-) By the time they're (James/Liam) old enough to read teen stuff they'll inherit a collection of SAS boysown books enough to teach them all the tricks in the world on survival techniques, how to seduce a woman (or not) how to shoot their way out of trouble, and how to escape scot free.
Seriously, I truly thought AM a possibility for the "Biggles" route...Note I wrote possibility in full, 'cause *poss* might have brought out the d d and a posse in a flushed flurried angst.
Chill
Did anyone else watch the Big Read - Alan Titchmarsh doing his Rebecca bit?
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 10:11)
BTW: the transcript sent private to named persons was the *Official ThisisLondon transcript* - just a jogger so those who received don't think they were cheated on in any way, or that is was edited backstage.
The Emma who posted was and is not me. Seriously, I would have used a specific non de plume the Man knows me by!
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 10:21)
Dark Forces
It's definitely not Nutter, my questions are still there ;o)
>>By Lynn (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 11:44)
Re Dark Forces,....
Well all of my questions are there too (3).
And will Nutter ever come back to us...??After he's been poof'd,... don't think so.
BABES. Where are ya? Don't ya work on sundays too??
Buddy : what's AM's LB? I know what LL andLD are but can't figure out the LB? (Thought of liberation Bay with P. Anderson, but can't see AM ending up with her, or can I, ....... now you'd really disappoint me mr Mcnab)
>>By borisette (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 12:17)
Borisette. "The first cut is the Deepest" LOL, should have read as LD.
P. Anderson? Dunno so much, there was a piece in a Sunday rag last week about people looking for themselves within partners...It showed pics of celebs and their other self reflected. Amusing, and incredible likeness'!!...As for AM and partner - all depends on how a reader imagines/conjures the man... All lean and suntanned and looking dangerous and hungry, or very hairy and darkly ape-like tossing banana skins...But hey, he's good at hanging from chandeliers...
Nutter: he can't come back as nutter - totalled by the forces that be here - and he isn't interested in putting on a mask 'cause it wouldn't change the person behind it.
>>By buddy (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 12:44)
Buddy : Tell Nutter just to try....there can be many different nutters, and doesn't mean that this nutter is the nutter we all know, could be another nutter..
We could have BG and B muffel up MG so that Nutter can do his entry back. With the help of Stan offcourse. What the hell am I talking about,.... Had too much Brunello last night.
As for AM looking all suntanned, lean etc...
Shouldn't he be the greyman, looking quite plain, unnoticable....dirty socks ...
Anyway read somewhere that Anderson will die soon, 'cause she's got severe hepatitis.(hope for her it isn't so, not that I bother about the woman at all)
>>By borisette (Sunday, 23 Nov 2003 13:13)
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