Andy Mcnab
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I have a theory about why squaddies resent 'Nab, Curtis, etc., and it's got nothing to do with security. For starters, virtually everyone I've ever known feels their life would make a good book--sadly, they're nearly always wrong, but believe it nonetheless. How much more inflated would one's sense of self-importance be after serving in an elite unit and participating in various adventures around the globe? I'm sure everyone who's ever served in SAS feels they've a book in them. Problem is, McNab has something many of them don't--he's a good writer. The SEALs experienced this same "book envy" after Richard Marcinko published "Rogue Warrior"--with, again, many SEALs forgetting that being a SEAL, in and of itself, does not a bestseller make.
I know the PC argument is that McNab and others broke the "code of silence" or gave away "secrets." To that I say, Paladin Press was a better source for operational details when McNab was still an RGJ squaddie, and, besides, most of the techniques some think are "secret" are really common sense. What makes SAS effective is that they've the luxury of practicing over and over, ad infinitum, which most "bad guys" can't afford to do.
Anyway, sorry for the rant, but I think the only (reasonable) explanation for resentment against successful SAS writers is just plain envy.
>>By Just Jon (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 06:29)
Good article Mag? good job you's up Buddy's/Dev's arse at SpecialForces Yahoo Groups or you'd have missed that one.
about your question lynn on Falklands. You can't have it both ways. post shit on the SBS and carry on like you's all sugar sweet when you want one of us to help you out.
you been reading aib brainwaves just jon? You got aib voice off to a T.
envy of Mcnab et al in't the issue. he shot hisself in foot with Daily Mirror article. told the whole world what the SAS are backpacking in firepower. that puts the teams in danger and no surprises then the world and his wife (you lot) and terrorists are up for grabs for an SAS/SBS shirt.
me best mate's a bestselling author and he don't shite on his own
>>By poolesprocket (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 09:37)
got a juicy article maj on mcnabber. "mcnab spied coming out of private clinic"
a journalist hung around thinking his wife had been in for a tit/face lift then he noticed mcnab had bruisingswelling round his jowls. p'raps he had lypo suction for that christmas pud arse re BMW pic
posted special forces yahoo group.
>>By poolesprocket (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 09:44)
A little story - my humble opinion (or an attempt, feel free to laugh – I laugh at myself too)
You want to cross the street, there’s a store that has Big Sale, it’s got a lot off the stuff you want but it’s always been pretty expensive. There’s not much traffic but the walking sign is red so you wait. You wait because you know that’s what you’ve been taught to do. And you know it’s morally right. And safe. Then a young guy comes standing next to you, looks at traffic and crosses the street ignoring the red sign. Enters the shop. You growl and think ‘typical youth of today’. And then another guy walks past you ignoring the red sign. And while you’re patiently waiting you get a bit restless and start to get wondering why they ignore the red sign. Are you a fool for being the only one waiting?
More people cross the street and all go buy the stuff you may wanted to buy yourself. Or maybe you didn’t but you would like to have had the choice. It may be sold out soon and you gnash your teeth. Then the light turns green and a sigh of relief escapes you, it stressed you out doing what you know is right. And you’re angry with those who didn’t. Angry because they are rewarded by doing something that is not right in your believes. Angry at yourself even but you don’t know exactly why. You were the one that followed the rules, it’s unfair!
I think the older guys have most trouble with breaking the ‘silence is not just golden, it’s the only way’ rule. The younger generation may blame the writers for the agreement they had to sign. Envy will have to do with it for some. Anyway, my point being that we’ve heard a lot since we came here, and for myself I can say that I’ve not forgotten much. But it’s still my own choice to enjoy the books. Maybe I’m too bitchy when it comes to negative stuff about McNab – but I’ve heard it so many times that it’s a matter of tiredness. So he’s not God, so what. Who is? Nothing as boring as perfection anyway (unless it’s my own perfection). ;-)
Ah wanted to post this and I see Pooly has been here too.
Post shit on the SBS - I post what's in the news - we need you to tell us if it's shit or not. I was not asking you to help me out, I was asking you to post here some of your insights without all the anger that splashes of the screen when you post.
>>By Lynn (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 10:10)
Somebody mentioned Ultimate Force, I thought it was quite good but a woman in the SAS? Stood there nekkid with a line of blokes? At first I mocked, then thought that if they had decided to allow women to become fully badged, unlike Int 14 operators, would it be public knowledge? It certainly makes sense having them there as the story illustrated and there are now a number of female fighter pilots so why not?
Maj, the dodgy sex scenes in CR books don't occur until he stops being Geordie Sharp and becomes Matt Browning, I await your opinion with interest!
So, McNab is now a porker? Thought that shirt he wore at the book signing was generously tailored!
>>By camban (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 12:20)
Just read the motors link that Maj provided, I recall that he only bought the Porsche because the salesman sneered at him, but he prefers the gas guzzling monsters that most of us right thinking citizens despise, oh dear. Must also question the assertion that the SAS in NI didn't use souped up motors that looked normal; other authors contradict that. Also take issue with the assertion that the troops were 'taught' to drive at high speed by rally drivers, CR says they didn't have time to learn it properly and were crap drivers, hence all the wreckage. I know from personal experience that you cannot teach people to drive at very high speed, it is innate, you can either do it or you can't, like an art form.
>>By camban (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 12:43)
I don't know how Maj found the article she posted, but the easy way to find the latest McNab articles is to google "andy mcnab articles site:.uk"
If you do so, you'll see that the article Maj posted comes up fourth, right on the first page.
Gotta go now, AIB's brainwaves are calling...
>>By Just Jon (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 13:17)
<<good job you's up Buddy's/Dev's arse at SpecialForces Yahoo Groups or you'd have missed that one.>>
huh??
>>By Majorette (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 13:28)
ohhhh, wait...... I get it, I get it....... Apparently there is some duplication in the type of information that appears both on SpecialForces Yahoo Groups and the Andy McNab board.
wow. I'm flabbergasted.
*rolls eyes*
If I were up somebody's arse, they'd know it.
>>By Majorette (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 13:37)
Camban:
Not so sure that I agree with you regarding a person's total incapacity to be able to learn how to operate a moving vehicle at high speeds. The police regularly use professional drivers (rally etc) as instructors for just that sort of thing. I once saw a documentary on the Discovery channel where the British Police had their own "driving-at-high-speeds" course. Amongst other things, they were thought high-level observation techniques.
Also, funny you mentioning CR in this respect. If I'm not very much mistaken, Geordie Sharpe (in either 'Stand by, stand by' or 'Zero Option') is going through a similar course in NI as training before going on ops. Tuned up Sierra's and the like was apparantly the order of the day.
So, if your CR-quote is authentic, then he's obviously contradicting himself a bit in terms of bringing authenticity to his books. On the other hand, who's to say he's not thinking "well, WE didn't have time to do this when I was in the Regiment, but for Geordie, there was a more efficient SAS" or something like that.
For Majorette, I can back up the fact that the cheesy sex-bits is not evident in Geordie Sharpe's stories, but more a thing that happens when the lead character is doing covert/black ops on the behalf of the Firm, Five or other "civvie Ruperts" organisations.
So it's not just a Matt Browning thing, but it was present in 'The Hit List and 'The Watchman' as well I think (where the leads were Neil Slater and Alex Temple).
>>By ortlieb (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 14:28)
Thanks Orty, I've seen that documentary about the police driving course and can only tell you that they were clearly terrified which confirms my experience that you cannot function effectively in that environment in that state. There is no truth in the adrenaline rush stuff, as a novice rally driver, you soon realise that any kind of impairment of that kind is very dangerous. But further than that, I once ran courses of that kind and found that no amount of instruction can overcome basic inability, simple as that. The CR quotes came from a recent edition of 'Fifth Gear' which I mentioned on the CR board a while back.
Thanks for the reminder about CR's other alter-egos, forgot about them.
>>By camban (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 15:51)
I once spoke a gentleman who is maintained under the care of the Government Car & Despatch Agency. He specialises in security driving and all that is associated with this area and is tasked with driving various VIP individuals to their relevent destinations. Such task includes the confident handling of a vehicle at high speed under threat. He explained that all Agency staff tasked with this duty are capable and experienced in doing such a thing to a level but some are naturally significantly more skilled than others. He has always maintained that you can only be taught to a point, where further experience will better you to a degree. However, some individuals go well beyond the teaching in experience as they naturally have an aptitude for this. As mentioned before, this is something that you cannot teach.
Ultimate Force - now there's a good all-round entertaining series. I enjoyed it a great deal and look forward to the next installment. One must remember though that it is just a fictional programme based on elements of facts. Like many items on TV, political correctness has obviously made it's mark on Ultimate Force with black soldier (I hope this is the correct terminology) in the SAS or a woman. I have a feeling through my experience in the Army that a number of women do work with the SAS in certain roles, in particular the Signals, but also in certain operational duties. However, factually, there are no badged women in the Regiment as they would have to have been selected from prior army regiments and I know for a fact that there are no "women Paras" in the sense of operational field soldiers of the Parachute Regiment. However, again as we know, the only thing that stops a woman from entering Credenhill service is physiology. I personally think women make terrific soldiers and are totally equal in levels of skill. If women could equal men in the execution of physiological demands I'd have them by my side with my detachment anytime.
Crisis Four - Film ! ..............what's all this about ! Lynn, please please enlighten me.
Reg
>>By Reginald (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 18:39)
<< I read in Zoo Weekly magazine a few days ago that Warner Brothers have almost completed filming>>
woah...... I'd be surprised if this were true, seeing as how Miramax bought the rights to Crisis Four, not Warner Brothers.
Of course, I don't really care WHO produces it, as long as it's done well and true to the book (which it won't be). *sigh*
>>By Majorette (Tuesday, 11 Jan 2005 22:24)
CRISIS FOUR
by Vorsim Brothers
Directed by
John Woo
Starring
Nick Stone -- Mel Gibson
Josh -- Danny "I'm too old for this shit" Glover
Sarah -- Barbra Streisand
Bad guy 1 -- Gary Busey
Bad guy 2 -- Jean Claude van Damme
Plus a whole bunch of actors whose names we really can't remember...
>>By ortlieb (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 00:13)
Nice one, Ort!
>>By Just Jon (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 00:23)
hmmm... Warner Brothers, Vorsim Brothers.... oh why the hell not?
CRISIS FOUR
Directed by The Wachowski Brothers
STARRING
Nick Stone - Hugo Weaving
Josh - Lawrence Fishburne
Sarah - Gina Gershon
Lynn - Joe Pantoliano
Bad Guy 1 (aka Assassin #1) - Sylvester Stallone
Bad Guy 2 (aka Assassin #2) - Antonio Banderas
Metal Mickey - Wayne Knight (Sorry, couldn't find a suitable Wachowski character, so had to borrow "Newman" from Seinfeld)
Fight scenes choreographed by Yuen Wo Ping.
New special effect "Cross Bow Time" is already so popular, Gap is now filming their next commercials using this new technique.
>>By Majorette (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 01:21)
y'all forgetting Andy McNab as technical advisor?? hehe
How about the Coen brothers for directors, at least they got
humour ;-)
Nick Stone -
http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0318649
/sahara2.jpg
Sarah -
http://film.onet.pl/_i/news/duze
/b/bridget_moynahan_1.jpg
Josh -
http://www.iofilm.co.uk/festivals/edinburgh/
2001/pix/lennie_james.jpg
Lynn -
the joke is too obvious so I'll go for
http://www.aveleyman.com/ActorsH
/P00007693.HTML
Elizabeth
http://www.kinoweb.de/film97/SomeMothersSon
/pix/mirren.jpg
Mickey
http://www.aveleyman.com/ActorsS
/P00016151.HTML
Bad
http://www.aveleyman.com/ActorsC
/P00037942.HTML
Bad
http://www.geocities.com/elinececile
/NickBrimble.JPG
Osama Bin Laden
http://www.gotlaughs.com
/funpages/bin13.jpg
>>By Lynn (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 09:55)
Oh darn, Clive is still very tasty too and more British. But being a possible new 007 - ???
http://www.murphsplace.com
/owen/film/dead/images/clive-jonathan.jpg
>>By Lynn (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 10:54)
hi yall
>>By Rinon (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 16:12)
Greetings Rinon
What, pray tell, does the tinfoil you are wearing on your profile picture do exactly? Should we all be wearing it? Is there something we ought to know here?
>>By bookyhelen (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 22:02)
I think that people who wear tin foil are kind of like people who wear latex--best not to ask them why.
>>By Just Jon (Wednesday, 12 Jan 2005 22:50)
Re the tin foil attire:
A) he thinks he's a turkey
B) he is a turkey (still at school at 19?)
C) he is a messy eater
D) dunno mate
>>By camban (Thursday, 13 Jan 2005 11:47)
Did anybody hear that Desert Island Discs show the other day? It will be rerun this Friday......
Apparently there was an article yesterday in "The Express" which talks about a few choice remarks made by McNab. No clue what kind of periodical The Express is, so I have no context in which to place what was written, but for the curious, you can read it at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AMFTroop/ (Sorry, I couldn't find it online outside of the news database at school).
(Yes, Camban, school. I am still in school at the ripe old age of 29. Maybe if I stopped wasting my time on this board I'd actually graduate, eh? LOL)
>>By Majorette (Thursday, 13 Jan 2005 19:06)
Tomorrow's rerun of Desert Island:
"Sue Lawley's - castaway - this week is the former SAS soldier turned author Andy McNab."
From 9.00-10.45
Ahem - I will miss it again, hospital tomorrow morning...to take my
cast away !!!! LOL, I could cry but the coincidence is too funny :-)
>>By Lynn (Thursday, 13 Jan 2005 19:22)
Cast away, eh Lynn?
I'll never watch the movie with Tom Hanks the same way again after that obvious
Zucker-bro's pun... :-p
Just finished Greed, and it was actually quite good. So I stand corrected with my initial verdict: "a total piece of crap". Now, although the sexy stuff is still cheezy, it is actually a part of the story-telling and an introduction of certain characters and their role in the plot.
So it's more of a case of the authors style of writing rather than plot-weakness.
So, all in all: well done, Mr. Ryan.
And I hear rumors that DB isn't AM's best by far. Should this prevent me buying it?
>>By ortlieb (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 00:32)
Nothing should prevent you buying it, Ort. Not famine, not war, not death itself.
Now, as for reading it...I concur, it's a long way from being McNab's best. I can think of only one character in the novel whose motivations seem even halfway reasonable, and it sure as hell ain't Nick Stone. Likewise, certain plot elements are unbelievably contrived--I'm talking Twilight Zone coincidences with a good measure of soap-opera drama added for spice.
On the plus side, the settings, as always, feel real and we're always given interesting, little-known facts about the various locales Stone visits. McNab also does a good job of capturing the atmosphere of moral ambiguity which hangs over any war.
All in all...Worth buying, worth a read, but probably not a future English Lit. assignment.
>>By Just Jon (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 06:49)
Right.... Finished Deep Black yesterday. Anyone else read it yet? Won't give anything away, but I thought it was more interesting than exciting this time, when usually the two are fused together very well.
>>By Ignaty (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 11:45)
Argh, I AGAIN forgot to listen to "Desert Island Discs" with McNab. PLEASE tell me someone recorded it!
>>By Just Jon (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 13:07)
Oh, one more thing...Andy said he'll answer a few questions for us at Grey Man's Land. If you would like to ask him something, please flork me with your question by 1/15/05 and I'll pass it along. I can't guarantee he'll answer 'em all, so make 'em good.
>>By Just Jon (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 14:54)
Jon !!!!!!!!!!!! that is awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
QUESTIONS QUESTIONS QUESTIONS QUESTIONS - got plenty but if they're all decent I'm not sure ;-))
You did great Jon, very very proud of you and of Greymansland !! :-)
>>By Lynn (Friday, 14 Jan 2005 17:03)
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