Andy Mcnab
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A little one, but still and all
He waved it 'round, because, I say,
He never had two anyway.
>>By Just Jon (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 02:44)
Is that from Revenge of the Nerds Jon?
Hey Maj!!!!!!! Good to see you back :-))
I felt it too, the book really is 'deep black' and I think it was meant to be. It was absolutely a Nick wandering, just going with the flow not really caring where that would take him. When he found out the 'special' Nuhanovic was just another 'politician' he killed him off - and I'm curious if this is a confirmation for Nick that there is no good in the world. And what's that gonna do in the next book since that may be the last one. Is Nick gonna accept that it's a dirty world and he himself is what he is (a piece in George's plays) or will he be able to get away from it all?? Still a bit struggling with my former question about Deep Black - is one allowed to say you enjoyed the book when it contains such horrible (reality) details? What do you think?
>>By Lynn (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 12:40)
May have been a fluke yesterday, Lynn...
... you being able to post without being logged into Flork (or maybe MG was working on it at the time you tried?) cuz posting is still restricted to registered Flork members when I just tried it now.
For the time being, I guess we can just ask MG for extra invite codes and pass them along via links posted on our profiles... :o)
>>By am-i-binned (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 17:13)
Ok sqaud, attention! right here is the briefing for all brits ultimate force is back tomorrow night, gone is the drama and the trying nto be a sas version of the bill.. instead its a cross between saving private ryan and die hard, and boy does it look good.. so 9pm tomorrow night beer and crisps for the ladies sherry and chocolates.. hahhahaha
on Play.com they have the eddie stone sas series that was on the beeb earlier in the year, and has been playing on uk doc channel...
too all f-troop have a great weekend, question how do you get on greymansland
ok at ease sitrep over.
>>By f-trooper bri (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 19:21)
Lynn-
I know what you mean. I remember when I read Black Hawk Down... I always felt weird telling people I "enjoyed" it. Just didn't seem right. And though it may be more PC, saying it "held my interest" doesn't even begin to describe how I felt reading it.
As for Deep Black...
Since you bring up Nuhanovic, that reminds me of something else. I had a hard time understanding Stone's motives for wanting to meet him. I mean, it's not like the man was Mother Teresa. Perhaps the idea was that Nick Stone initially saw Nuhanovic as a sort of Oskar Schindler based on his actions at the cement factory, but I still don't buy it as a strong enough motivator to get Stone off the couch years later and look the guy up, even with his photographer friend pushing him to. I dunno, Stone just doesn't seem like the kind of guy who would feel the need to rub elbows with saints, y'know?
A more plausible motivator (in my very humble opinion) would have been the simple desire to get back into the game. Several times Stone admits how much more confortable he is in the Sandbox surrounded by contractors and guys decked out in the latest tactical gear from BlackHawk Industries... To me, that would have been enough reason to accompany his friend on his photo shoot. Why not just have Nick Stone join the growing army of private contractors and security personnel in the Middle East? George can't threaten him anymore, Nick Stone goes independent, yada yada yada and hilarity ensues.
(Yes, that last sentence was tongue in cheek.)
Did anybody else find Nuhanovic a weak link?
>>By Majorette (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 20:26)
<< how do you get on greymansland >>
just go to: http://www.greymansland.com
enjoy! :o)
>>By am-i-binned (Friday, 7 Jan 2005 21:47)
Interesting point you make, Majorette, vis-a-vis "enjoying" Black Hawk Down. I have a similar problem describing my feelings about McNab's writing, one that generally crops up when a "highbrow" type asks me what writers I enjoy. In those instances, I make sure to point out I like McNab, Crichton, etc., for "entertainment only," just as, when speaking to a scientist, I make sure to call Carl Sagan's books "pop science."
I wonder, though, what IS the major difference between, say, McNab's descriptions of human suffering in "Deep Black" and Steinbeck's in "Grapes of Wrath?" Or Nick Stone's unrequited love and, say, Gatsby's? My personal take on this is that there is a universality to great art, that Steinbeck and Fitzgerald leave us knowing more about the human condition whereas McNab leaves us knowing about, well, McNab.
Does anyone else have any thoughts on this? And has anyone else frantically hidden the McNab collection behind "The Complete Works of Shakespeare" and "The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire" before guests arrived?
>>By Just Jon (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 06:08)
<< And has anyone else frantically hidden the McNab collection behind >>
Now I absolutely KNOW you're not talking to me, Jon, cuz you've actually seen my bookshelves! Raided them even! I have McNabs behind McNabs, but all are in pride of place! :o)
>>By am-i-binned (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 06:21)
I have Shakespeare hidden behind my McNabs - though I don't know why, I never read Shakespeare. Oh haha, so that's why.
Interesting though Jon, I think McNab is best compared to writers of his own genre - and no need to tell you who I think is best in that one.
Maj, I did not forget answering you, but no time now - catch ya later ;-)
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 10:00)
missing ball. who needs two when one will do? old news but relevent to ball power games
http://www.freerepublic.com
/focus/f-news/653359/posts
>>By poolesprocket (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 10:24)
I always felt weird telling people I "enjoyed" it
why feel uncomfortable about having enjoyed a book or film that was made for entertainment?. All these books are written to depict events or lead us on adventures of fiction, so why would it be wrong to have said that you enjoyed it, the genre of the books make it a neccesity to be violent and if the authour has been there and done it they can be more descriptive of the events, which can turn peoples stomachs, but it's the image that is conjured up in your mind that does the damage the authour just gives you the tools. i bet if we all picked a mcnab novel and agreed on a part of the book to draw and bring to life, we would have a very different view, so it's going to be the same with the violence some will make it over blown and sick and some will sanitise it more.
>>By fony (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 12:00)
Jon- Hahaha.... I would never have put Andy McNab in the same sentence as Fitzerald and Steinbeck, but since you did I guess I'll think on it a bit. Perhaps you're right..... perhaps there is no real difference between the characters' angst each one explores. Deep down it's all about how people deal with tragic situations. I'd have to be honest, though, and say McNab is not in the same league as Fitzgerald and Steinbeck, technique-wise. Of course if I'm being TOTALLY honest, I'd also have to say I would much rather curl up with a Nick Stone adventure than re-read Grapes of Wrath or The Great Gatsby.
It's like if I'm faced with a choice between burgers and fries or filet mignon, I'll pick the burgers and fries every time. I know the filet mignon will be good, but I think it's much more fun to eat food with your fingers; You get to lick them afterwards. With a filet mignon, you sort of have to dissect your meal with a sterile knife and fork. That just feels a little more.... distant to me.
As for the question of why I feel funny saying I "enjoyed" these books..... well, fony, you make some valid points. I can't argue with them. All I know is that if I ever came face to face with the surviving relatives of the men who died in Black Hawk Down, I would NOT tell them, "hey, I really enjoyed reading about your son's last 24 hours." It just seems.... sick. And while McNab's books are fiction, I still carry the same wariness.
I enjoy reading about the human spirit, how it rises to greater heights in the face of adversity. I love reading about the brotherhood that develops between men facing impossible odds. And I am fascinated by how flaws in a person's character can be turned into strengths when the need arises. Unfortunately, these things do not come about unless there are challenges to be met. That's why where there is good, there is usually bad and ugly, too.
So... no, I do not particularly enjoy reading about women being raped, children being abused, innocent people being killed needlessly, or good men dying in their prime. But I realize that this stuff happens, in real life and in books. I guess my fear in saying I enjoyed a book that describes such things stems from a need to clarify that I don't enjoy reading about pain and suffering. I DO enjoy reading about how people overcome these things. I find that incredibly uplifting.
>>By Majorette (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 14:37)
<<missing ball. who needs two when one will do? old news but relevent to ball power games>>
Well, if this SBS bloke lost a ball in the process of saving the CIA guy's life, at least he can hang his shiny new MOH a little low and try to regain some symmetry. hahahahaha
Just kidding, Poolesprocket. I actually know a guy with only one ball. It's no different than women with only one breast. But I admire anyone who can see the humor in misfortune and rise above it.
And a big heartfelt thanks to the SBS for helping out the Yanks in a bad situation. Yet another reason we love the Brits.
>>By Majorette (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 15:00)
Ah Maj - drafted my post but got distracted, so it's a bit what you said, but I'll post it anyway.
Fony
If it's just fiction - it's ok to call it entertaining. My problem is with details that are based on reality. Reading about cruelty and realising that those things really happened (and most likely even worse). Can you still call that 'entertainment' only for the fact that a writer has woven it into a fictional story?
Like take Black Hawk Down, as Jon mentioned - the movie is 'entertainment' because it's a movie, but when you realise some soldiers cry watching it because it takes them back to what they lived through - how 'entertaining’ is that? Come to think of it, Black Hawk Down is even a computer game! Because it’s not ‘real’ it’s ok to enjoy shooting down people?
Now you can say - rightfully - if you take it like that you best only read you Donald Ducks and stick to Disney games where to ‘worst’ thing that happens is Pumpaa eating live bugs. True - but it can't hurt to stop and think about it for a moment.
Pooley, I know you don't give a toss but my compliments for your response. Then again .... it were your own friends who once said that all SAS/SBS men lie through their teeth. Makes it hard to judge your true intentions. Goes basically against my nature but two years of intrigues have unbalanced my nature somewhat. Sadly.
>>By Lynn (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 15:39)
Reminder: McNab. Radio. Tomorrow. Listen.
And another thing--you can't go bein' a dickhead, draw a dickhead response, and then all of a sudden be mature and witty. Makes me look bad.
Oh, and one more thing--my drinkin' mate owes me a banner!
Alright, one more thing, and that's it--what's Dinger up to these days? Just general, don't care to write him a fan letter or hear his life story.
>>By Just Jon (Saturday, 8 Jan 2005 20:27)
*sigh* Missed the radio interview.... a little early for me unfortunately. Maybe I'll try to catch the repeat this Friday, but that show is on even earlier so......
Is this the same interview that made all the headlines because it was postponed so many times?
At the very least, I checked out his musical selections. Never thought I'd share the same musical tastes as McNab but lo and behold he's got The Swan by Saint Saens listed. (Only the most beautiful cello solo ever written.) Good for you, McNab! Maybe you're not all burgers and fries afterall! ;-)
>>By Majorette (Sunday, 9 Jan 2005 16:52)
Missed it too and no 'Listen Again' available, sigh - 'nother chance on Friday though. His list of choice is on the BBC website though,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/factual
/desertislanddiscs.shtml
Shivering one (as read in Telegraph):
Horror still in the air as 'ghost' island revives:
Phi Phi means "many ghosts" in Thai, and never was the meaning more appropriate for an island where countless bodies now lie under the rubble.
(..)
Someone was apparently reading The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Nighttime. Other books, by Fay Weldon and Andy McNab, lie abandoned.
From Desert Island to deserted books on an Island :-(
In the Mirror:
Ross Kemp is back in a blaze of bullets as Red Troop, the crack SAS team, return to action with the DVD release of ULTIMATE FORCE - Series II.
(...)
But you can win yourself one of five copies we're giving away right here. We've also got a parka, compass, dvd, book and hat to give away.
So anyone interested:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/competitions/competitions
/page.cfm?objectid=15041796&method
=full&siteid=50143
An oldie too but since it's ok to post older articles: Telegraph
(Filed: 26/07/2004)
The Army has transferred a number of instructors from the SAS headquarters in Hereford to the SBS to improve its fighting skills and abilities at operating behind enemy lines.
While the SBS is expert at operations at sea or close to the shore, there have been mutterings that it runs into problems in land patrols.
times'up for now, see y'all later :-(
>>By Lynn (Sunday, 9 Jan 2005 18:12)
Best to be accurate in releasing discrediting comments about SBS, dutchy.
Costa de Sol were rubbish report, so were report of SBS cowardice in Iraq.
re End your rift, SAS and SBS are told
Telegraph | News | End your rift, SAS and SBS are told
By Sean Rayment Defence Correspondent
(Filed: 01/08/2004)
The Telegraph can reveal that the soldier who refused to work with the SBS was one of the SAS's most experienced sergeant-majors. He made his forthright comments during a briefing by senior members of the SBS to their SAS counterparts.
A few weeks later, he was attached to the SBS's M squadron for the duration of an operation and later made a full and public apology to the unit, admitting that his comments about the SBS were "out of order" and that he was "speaking rubbish". According to serving and former members of both elite groups an intense but professional rivalry has always existed between them. In recent months, however, there has been a growing sense of irritation within the SBS that many of their operations are reported as being carried out by the SAS.
the rest of the article is available at Special Forces Yahoo group.
>>By poolesprocket (Sunday, 9 Jan 2005 21:56)
Well my Poodlesquirt, the End your rift article was posted here yonks ago - on page 189
Link to the article for the non YSF members:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/
main.jhtml;sessionid
=CWGVFMX4DKHERQFIQMFCM5OAVCBQYJVC?
xml=/news/2004/08/01/nrift01.xml&secureRefresh
=true&_requestid=8211
Sounds good to me End your Rift? What do you say??
>>By Lynn (Sunday, 9 Jan 2005 22:22)
Very off topic but also impressive enough to want to share,
Tsunami before-and-after pictures.
http://homepage.mac.com/demark/tsunami/1.html
>>By Lynn (Sunday, 9 Jan 2005 22:41)
Someone earlier asked if anyone had read The Watchman by Chris Ryan.
I have, and I think it's a masterpiece. IMHO, clearly the best of the CR-books I've read so far.
I'm currently reading CR's "Greed", and I'm amazed by the fact that it's in fact a total piece of crap. It's like reading a cheesy Jackie Collins pulp fiction novel.
Haven't read "Land of Fire", so I don't know if it's the Matt Browning character that's doing it or what.
I rarely pass through this section of the jungle these days (ooh, an F-Troop ref ;-) ) , but I am surprised to (still) find that the tone of this board often makes me expect to find parksuit-wearing kiddies with sandbox shovels in their hands and snot running from their noses.
But if you'll excuse me, I think there's a maggot with my name on it.
Bye for now...
>>By ortlieb (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 02:11)
Ok Pooley, here's one for you. Maybe you would care to give a serious comment on this one?
During the Falklands War 2 SBS took part of liberating South Georgia and 6 SBS reconnoitered in East Falkland. Their only losses were to friendly fire from the SAS.
>>By Lynn (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 10:18)
Duncan Falconer's take on the above-referenced event was interesting--especially the aftermath, when the SAS troopers responsible were overheard discussing it in less-than-polite terms. It sounded to me like both SAS and SBS had been assigned overlapping areas of operation, which, if it didn't cause the unfortunate event, at least made a friendly-fire incident much more likely.
I too, would appreciate it if Poole, or someone with the same type of knowledge about this and similar incidents, could enlighten us further.
Also, does anyone know if the SAS men involved in Operation Flavius have appeared in any of the multitude of SAS books in other circumstances? I know Falconer mentions dangling one of them off an oil rig...Have any of them cropped up elsewhere?
>>By Just Jon (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 13:59)
Found this just by chance while looking up something else. For those of you who like things that go vvvvrrrooooooom:
SAS guide to the mean streets... Me and My Motors: Andy McNab
http://driving.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,12389-1429750,00.html
>>By Majorette (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 18:16)
And here's that original "something else" I was looking for.......
Fastsellers of 2004:
"The Guardian's exclusive list of paperbacks that flew off the shelves"
Pos Title Genre Author Nat Imprint RRP Mth UK sales Export Total Gross
#46 Greed Thriller (A) Chris Ryan Br Arrow £6.99 May 256,118 37,863 293,981 £2,054,927
#52 Dark Winter Thriller (A) Andy McNab Br Corgi £6.99 Oct 232,645 33,443 266,088 £1,859,955
I haven't read Greed yet, Orty, but the numbers appear to favor it over Dark Winter.
I'm slowly making my way through Chris Ryan's Geordie Sharp series and I have to say I'm pleasantly surprised. So far they have... held my interest. Not sure where all the jokes come from about the sex scenes, though, since I don't recall many steamy scenes at all. (Maybe that's why? Were they that forgettable??) Just starting Tenth Man Down, so maybe I'll stand corrected....
George599 mentioned The Watchman..... I'll concur with Orty, it's a great book. Ryan's finest, I think.
>>By Majorette (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 18:29)
Great article Maj!!
>>By Lynn (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 19:16)
Hi all
Apologies in advance because I know this subject would of been covered many times, but I can't seem to find any recent info regarding the Crisis Four movie and I'm hoping that someone would be kind enough to update me on the current situation. I read in Zoo Weekly magazine a few days ago that Warner Brothers have almost completed filming and the film should be out later this year, but the mag has been unreliable before and I was hoping for more detailed info please. Also, a little tidbit of randomness which may be of interest, but probably not. Living in the Rhondda Valley and as he is mates with my uncle, I've had the honour of speaking to 'Mike Curtis', writer of CQB, a couple of times. We mainly discussed his book, but to my enquiries about Mcnab, he stated that he held him in very high regard and said that he was a top notch soldier and a good guy, if not a little gobby! He said that most of today's regiment do hold less favourable thoughts on Mcnab and himself, along with the other ex-regiment successful writers. He added that this initially suprised him and that he expected it from the ruperts, but not the lads. He hasn't spoken to Mcnab in a while but says he always has time for him. Sorry for the long post which is a little pointless I know.
Thanks,
Slim.
>>By TheSlim (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 21:49)
I am perfectly aware of the fact that Chris Ryan flak/praise can be aimed and fired at the Gnooks author site devoted to him specifically, but there's just more buzz in here.
Anyhow... As I was having a hard time falling asleep last night (obviously, my maggot's on the fritz), I spent some time getting more in-depth into 'Greed'. I have to say, in Mr. Ryan's defense, that it is picking up quite a bit! The plot is twisting and turning, just in tune with 'The Hit List' and 'The Watchman'. And luckily, the cheesy bits are now further apart.
>>By ortlieb (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 22:04)
Hi Slim,
@ your "Sorry for the long post which is a little pointless I know." ahem well... a messageboard with 226 pages would not have been this size if it was annoyed with long posts ;-)
I'm sorry that you seem to have more info on Crisis Four than we have had in a long time though. So please... keep us informed :-)
One question that has been keeping us busy for... eerr...226 pages is who is gonna play Nick Stone, so any thoughts on that? ;-)
Nice meeting you!
>>By Lynn (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 22:38)
there has been no posts since ultimate force was on tv on saturay night...
i thought it was a lot better than the second series, didn't watch the first yet... what did all of you think...
THERE IS ONE THING THOUGH
----- In AM's Books, when talking over the net, using clicks, its 2 clicks for yes and 1 click for no
QUOTE: "Click, Click"
in UF, heno said
1 click for yes
2 clicks for no
3 clicks for dont know
4 clicks for ask another question (this may have been a joke)
so, anyway... bye for now...
>>By Shoot-To-Kill (Monday, 10 Jan 2005 23:52)
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