Jack
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Today at dinner I started a discussion on Private education in America with an American. She told me that your FREE Education is appalling; and that is why many choose to send their kids to private schools. She also mentioned that the Tech Schools only admit the most intelligent from the PRIVATE schools, and that no matter how capable you were very few public school students attended these instituitions. Apparently there is a movement which would like "tokens" to be given to public school kids who are intelligent and willing to learn to be able to have their tuition fees at a Private school paid for.
"Strong Middle Class".
Another friend (from America) informed me a while ago that the middle class were not as strong as you might think: they are struggling financially to send their children to the private schools.
Now I believe the education system is under Federal Rule - yes?
Can you tell me what is wrong with the idea of free school education for all? Education to a high standard - if you like, private school standard, as I should think with all that extra money they were garnering would go a long way to a child's development & not the Headteacher's retirement fund - much as I dislike private schools. BIAM you mentioned a wee while ago that you would like the best for your kids educationally: and so would consider sending them to private schools. Well I respect this - in the bare bones of it all. Of course you want the best for your kids - everyone does (or should). But all children have the right to education of a high standard - and this should not be dependent on personal wealth. Two babies born on the same day in the same ward. One comes from a rich family, one from a poor. Do they both not have the same rights? So why should one suffer because of family background & circumstance & the other succeed.
You mention capitalism & how it allows you to achieve "high" goals; how it can buy you all the material possessions that you desire etc. Well it all comes back down to education. Only through Education can wealth be harnessed - there are a few exceptions to the rule of course. My family crawled their way out of "working class" (whatever that means anyway - I'm classless, I like to think.) to what is termed "lower middle class" through education. They managed to go to university - they failed their 11+ (so did John Prescott !!!) but they struggled for years to get to the financial shit hole sending your kids to uni gives you.
Straying from the point somewhat, I know - but I hope I'm getting my ideas across here. Education is the key to fulfilling life - and that should not be taken away or damaged by any personal financial matters.
"Opportunities in America are limitless" (ok not a direct quote)
You know - I keep on hearing Americans say this. On TV, in articles - but no one ever elaborates. Tell me, what are these fantastic opportunities - is it the one that we're all going to end up being moviestars & live in Hollywood - or..... because I really don't know. I am struggling to think what is so great & individual about America's opportunities.
<Socialists and communists could NEVER understand.>
*Sigh*.
Right - ok, BIAM has said this before, but I'll say it again. If you're not an out & our facist - it doesn't make you an extreme communist. If you're not a capitalist, it doesn't mean you want to set up a communist state & nationalize anything that moves. You may hate communism by growing up in the years of Stalin/the Cold War - fair enough, propaganda can last a long time & to be honest, Communism in Russia was pretty scary stuff. But that wasn't communism - communism is like.................... the tangent of 90 degrees - you can't ever get it. It's all good in theory, but lets face it - it would only work with machines (& ants....). Lenin realized this within a few years of implementing War Communism (Communism under the Russian Civil War). That's why he invented the NEP. But that caused a stir in Russia as well - because it went in the complete opposite direction, almost. The poor/rich divide was dramatically diverging & the economy scarily unstable. & Russian communism may also be confused with Stalinism. Stalin lets face it could not understand very much about the concepts of communism (I would back this up, but I've read this from books...which are unavailable to me now). Stalin is like any other human - corrupted by the desire for power. It would all happen to us & we all know it would. It's the ripple effect of trying to bend society to Stalin's bidding & the party's orders & all those in charge that is the COMMUNISM that you all know & hate. Communism: nice idea until you really think about it. Liberalism.... now THERE'S something......................
America Inc of course has its advantages & faults. It is only a few people that bring its 'reputation' down, I think. I'd love to think that there are a lot of sensible-minded people in America (I know of ONE..... but he's not American....)
From outside the US we get the impression that you are all a bunch of dogmatic thickies/righties with a hard-on for war (to put it in a nutshell). Would LOVE for this to be proven wrong......................
>>By Tchock (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 22:48)
BIAM
The foreign aid package in America is the highest dollar amount ANYWHERE, regardless of what your favorite periodical says.
After reading your reply I want to refer you to an 'anger management' program. You bring my disdain upon yourself....perhaps you could try another tact.....you might be surprised.
People come to America for the opportunities available....as you damn well know. None of your provacative language will obscure that. By reaching your age I would have imagined that you'd understand the 'why' of that. There is the saying that you can lead a horse to water, but CAM'T make it drink. I'm pretty sure that your views are beyond repair. I wonder what the 'gang' thinks??
I'd like to hear more about the miniscule aid amount that the USA regularly dishes out. Many Americans, myself included, wish that we were considerably less generous.
And, again, did you say leave Iran to the Israelis?? And, that is proactive AND responsible. Do you see an Iran/Syria connection, you think?? Again Bush'es council would be useful for you. Am sure that your BBC carries the President's speeches/addresses.
And how about Hugo Chavez of Venezuela. Now his country is about the same threat to the US as the Falklands were to Britain....and did the US condem you for wresting control from the Argentinians? No, we did not!! I could go on and on, but you'd never get it.
Here are some answers for you:
Democracy will prevail in Iraq.
America will NOT permit Iran to develop nuclear WEAPONS.
America will capture bin Laden...eventually.
Israel will remain secure with America and BRITAIN by its side.
<<<The highest murder rates, kids walking into schools and shooting their peers, and citizens who cant afford hospital treatment because they cant afford health insurance, yep a real utopia...>>>
THAT is straight from the Communist Daily Worker....NO ONE is denied medical care, or food PERIOD. If you believe what you said, you are STUPID. Come to my town, any town for that matter, and go to the hospital emergency room, state that you have no money OR insurance, and YOU WILL NOT BE DENIED TREATMENT.
And kids shooting kids in school points to an illness in America??? You are an idiot!!
>>By lv2read (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 22:56)
Right, well I didn't see the point in invading the Falklands whatosever, but either way America can NOT be the judge of invading other countries for the hell of it !!!
Lets face it the only reason America hates Venuzuala is because its SOCIALIST (oh my god ?!?!) & because it nationalized the oil industry so that the VENUZUALAN PEOPLE could benefit from the oil it has (albeit if its a earth-destroying timebomb...)
Democracy WILL Prevail in Iraq??
Hmmmm.... much like it does in Saudi Arabia then - ya know that nice ole country in which a great deal of the American Economy is based on.......
(lets face it the people of iraq are more likely to kill each other before anyone says .... oh alright then.......... go on i'll compromise - sorry, but they're all MAD over there... something in the water - lots of decent folk, i'm sure, but they never get the attention they deserve..........)
America WILL capture Bin Laden.............. yes you know, he's PROBABLY having tea & scones with Bush .... seeing as George does know the rest of his family & all...............
Kids shooting other kids in school an illness in America???
(& You don't see anything WRONG with this?!?!)
Firstly it is completley wrong for guns to be available to members of the public................ that is rule number one: never give possibly dangerous people the right to bear arms. Secondly - what kind of society allows their kids to be brought up in a gun culture...... And by this I mean - Britain watches action movies but we don't seem to shoot each other at school.......... but then again America has a larger population than us - so the likelihood is greater. Thirdly - why is it that kids feel the need to shoot someone?? Is it down to circumstance, or a greater fault of society?????
Lv2read, what do you think of the IMF refusing monetry aid to poor countries in Africa (& other continents) unless they spend a vast portion of the aid money towards creating a Pop Music Video on how great Privatization is; privatize their main power/water supplies prior to recieving the money etc......... ???
>>By Tchock (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 23:15)
"I'm pretty sure that your views are beyond repair."
haha by your standards thats pretty rich, get a few guilt feelings about running away when your generation was getting slaughtered in the paddy fields, does your mind make up for it by being a mega-hawk eh!! now if you said 'hey I ran away 'cos I was scared' I can understand that, or 'hey I ran way cos I believe the war was wrong' I can understand that too but your belligerence towards wasting soldiers and civilians on dubyas crusade is really sickening, you sir are the type of disease that perpetuated the first world war, a sickening cowardly war monger..
"I'd like to hear more about the miniscule aid amount that the USA regularly dishes out"
oh lordy here we go, do please try to read other peoples posts, I did say I couldnt really give a toss how much or how little aid the US gives, and that my opinion of the US really would not be swayed by aid..oh why can't you believe that, I really couldnt give a fuck about US aid and to which nations this aid goes to..
"Again Bush'es council would be useful for you. Am sure that your BBC carries the President's speeches/addresses".
I have already said that I care little for that moron's outbursts regardless of whether the BBC broadcasts them or not
"Come to my town, any town for that matter, and go to the hospital emergency room, state that you have no money OR insurance, and YOU WILL NOT BE DENIED TREATMENT."
oh I dare say the hypocratic oath would ensure that I was treated, the massive hospital bill would follow me post treatment though wouldn't it, and if you say it wouldnt then you are the idiot amongst us
and instead of me coming to your town, I will gladly pay for you to fly with me to Iraq to help out in one of the aid agencies, you see the difference is that I actually know people who work in Iraq in both the military and in civilian posts, so I know that it wouldnt be the democratic dreamland that you seem to think Iraq is, however I know your guts would turn to jelly before stepping anywhere near any aircraft bound for Iraq.
"And how about Hugo Chavez of Venezuela. Now his country is about the same threat to the US as the Falklands were to Britain....and did the US condem you for wresting control from the Argentinians? No, we did not!! I could go on and on, but you'd never get it."
oh yes thats right Venezuela has oil doesnt it, guess thats high on dubyas hit list, and as for the US helping the UK during the falklands conflict, you were big big friends with the Argentinians too if i remember correct, remember that murdering ultra right wing regime, and it took a fair old while before you finally swung support our way.
Oh by the way the Falklands werent a threat to the UK, the argentinian invasion of British soil was the catalyst to that one...
>>By BushisaManiac (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 23:25)
Lets face it the only reason America hates Venuzuala is because its SOCIALIST (oh my god ?!?!) & because it nationalized the oil industry so that the VENUZUALAN PEOPLE could benefit from the oil it has (albeit if its a earth-destroying timebomb...)>>>>
Nonsense.....juvenile....if it were that simple.
<<<and that is why many choose to send their kids to private schools. She also mentioned that the Tech Schools only admit the most intelligent from the PRIVATE schools,>>>>
The American (??) that said this knows that you'll fall for it and would not understand. A tech school (on the university level) is far from a trade school slightly below the level of high school. Nothin said in the paragraph above makes ANY sense. Sorry.
Let me say it simpler....private school students here go to selectice universities...some of which are technology biased......say like the Massachusetts Institute of Technology....at roughlu $40,000 per year if you refrain from eating!!!! Your American contact is toying with your youth and inexperience.
And if you don't understand that opportunity is synonmous with the USA, please retake 4th grade civics/
>>By lv2read (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 23:38)
hahahahahahha
sorry
but your last paragraph was just so hilarious
toying with my youth & inexperience
we were having a feckin' conversation on schools
she knew quite a lot having been to school in the US for the past 14 years of her life. Yes - that would make her EIGHTEEN - a YOUTHful eighteen year old. What are you talking about lv2read?? Really.
The American that said this had only just met me & had no idea who the feck I was let alone know what I would "fall for". Jeez. I'm sorry - but really.
Opportunity synonmous with the USA.... yet again avoiding the question.
I asked a perfectly simply question - what are all these wonderful amazing opportunities that America seems to offer that no other country does............... but no one has an answer. Is it because there is no uniqueness to it???? Is it because it's just some ploy by the marketing companies & the government to make you feel proud to be American because lets face it you've got nothing else to feel pride in: Black Slavery (Britain guilty also), Civil Rights disputes, countless wars being instigated by America, the way American Global Companies rape the poor of this world (** not literally.... just in case you can't fathom metaphors....)
& will you PLEASE stop rabbiting on about my "youth, naivity, inexperience".
It's rather dull & pathetic. It almost seems like you can't find any fault in my argument, so you're just damning me instead..........
Well this American described the Tech school as the place you would start off your engineering degree for instance. I hear it takes eight years to have the same degree as UK students who do Masters... over here it takes five. Thats three years more debt & financial hardship for students. Far better system huh?
>>By Tchock (Thursday, 28 Sep 2006 23:54)
>The American (??) that said this knows that you'll fall for it and would not understand.
I don't find it funny, I found it sickening that someone with so many years of experience behind him could be so petty and cynical. You know NOTHING about this person, and you have the sheer arrogance to say you know their agenda, and why? Because you're older. Well that doesn't cut it. Ok so you have more life experience than us, I can respect that, now for God's sake get over yourself.
I happen to think typing ''Bush'es'' instead of ''Bush's'' is laughable and somewhat undermines the authority you keep try to set yourself up with - it's the kind of thing your teacher should have corrected when you were half my age. I don't know, perhaps you were too busy planning your trip to Mexico to pay attention in English lessons.
See, I can be petty too. It just make everyone angry. Seriously, what's the point?
As for capitalism... well we had our own little debate about that. Something of an anti-climax.
>>By Flagg (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 01:11)
Ah, yes, America...Where you can own a Bentley and yet believe Argentina posed a "threat" to the UK, that reading Shakespeare is less rewarding than learning to free up a toilet drain, and that Hugo Chavez is on the verge of conquering the free world.
Hey Brits...Ya'll wouldn't happen to need an extra citizen, would you?
>>By Just Jon (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 01:48)
Tchock
<<<Well this American described the Tech school as the place you would start off your engineering degree for instance. I hear it takes eight years to have the same degree as UK students who do Masters... over here it takes five. Thats three years more debt & financial hardship for students. Far better system huh?>>>>
You've been 'had' again. In English---all of the above is WRONG.
Mechanical, Electrical, Chemical and Nuclear engineering degrees are attained in 4-5 years of college----period, end of sentence. A masters degree is an additional year, followed by three more years for a doctorate (Ph.D). What is pathetic is your acquaintence 'taking advantage of you!' What did that person tell you about the President??
Your point about higher education in America is ????????
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 03:31)
JUST JON
<<Ah, yes, America...Where you can own a Bentley and yet believe Argentina posed a "threat" to the UK, that reading Shakespeare is less rewarding than learning to free up a toilet drain, and that Hugo Chavez is on the verge of conquering the free world.
Hey Brits...Ya'll wouldn't happen to need an extra citizen, would you?>>>
No one said that the Falklands were a threat to your country. Did your leaders?? How rewarding is reading Shakespeare for the poor, uneducated person that has no marketable skills, no job and a bleak future. I'll agree that reading Shakespeare with the family on a Saturday night would greatly reduce enteretainment costs--but wouldn't his/her time be better spent in a trade school (sorry, no Shakespeare) learning valuable trades that will greatly improve his/her finances?? John, this is a no brainer.
p.s About the toilet drain....do you know what plumbers charge in the states? You might ask Tchock.
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 03:47)
L2R
"No one said that the Falklands were a threat to your country. Did your leaders?? "
No you muppet you did... read your first post on this page about ten lines down...and I will paraphrase..
"And how about Hugo Chavez of Venezuela. Now his country is about the same threat to the US as the Falklands were to Britain.."
You know you REALLY SHOULD read the posts properly before commenting on them, and that includes your own posts, otherwise you just seem to be making a fool of yourself
>>By BushisaManiac (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 08:59)
No you muppet you did... read your first post on this page about ten lines down...and I will paraphrase..
"And how about Hugo Chavez of Venezuela. Now his country is about the same threat to the US as the Falklands were to Britain..">>>
Big boy, Venezuela is NO threat to the US....a language peoblem??
Grow up before it is too late.
<<<You know you REALLY SHOULD read the posts properly before commenting on them, and that includes your own posts, otherwise you just seem to be making a fool of yourself>>
To read them, Maniac is one thing, but to comprehend/understand appears to be something else!!! I'll accept your apology even though you aren't man enough to offer it!! See below.
Would you like tio continue this discussion in this mannerm or would you prefer 'we' lighten up?? I can handle you either way.
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 11:22)
You telling other people to grow up. Honestly. L2R, you're virtually a cartoon character. You're a character from South Park. Every time you post it makes you less credible, harder to take seriously.
>>By Flagg (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 12:02)
hahaha
sorry lv2read, I did actually laugh quite out loud there.
You really to excell yourself here, unfortunately.
"You've been 'had' again."
It really does amaze me the way you cannot even discuss a simple point of "How long does a Masters Degree take in America?" without resulting to pure patheticness. You can't even reiterate someone's belief on something without you chastizing it because it's not what you think. Have you ever considered that it might be you has got it wrong??? No???
She I think knows slightly more about the modern Education system than you do - seeing as you are not in university and have not attended school for a very long time.
"What did she tell you about the President."
Ahhh man that is GENIUS. How your mind works, I've no idea. One minute you can be talking about a simple disagreement on a basic fact - & the next thing you can judge whether this girl is for or against the president. Well to be honest - she would vote for Bush for all I know. I didn't mention his name once. I had no idea of her politics - she could have been Dick Cheneys niece for all I knew. I love how everything you say whittles down to Das President. It's highly pathetic - really, how you automatically make assumptions on people because they disagree with you.
My point about American higher education is.............???
Well I don't really have one. It's called being interested. I would think it is much the same as it is here - quite costly to most, but worth it, even with the financial struggle.
Shakespeare vs. Trade Schools
Well maybe we need a little bit of variety. Not everyone can be engineers & the like, as not everyone can bury their head in literature. You know - here's an idea, how about our kids should study what... INSPIRES THEM. That would be nice wouldn't it? Poor people should go to Trade Schools instead of the academic/traditional schools. Who says??? We Jimmy from the ghetto might LOVE Shakespeare & hate the sight of all things mechanical. It should all come down to getting EVERYONE enthusiastic about something & go on to have a job they enjoy: whether that be as an engineer (like me) or having a Doctrate in English.
I would expect plumbers to charge the same as over here in Britain - extortionately overpriced. Plumbers ARE all human after all.........................
You know, everyone said that Iraq was a threat to "democracy & peace" in the world... but that really turned out to be one giant lie didn't it (who would have thought it). NO WMD !?!?!
&
really - what ARE these great opportunities in America (it would save me repeating 4th grade if you told me............)
>>By Tchock (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 12:08)
<Grow up before it is too late.>
Is that advice from experience??? ;)
>>By Tchock (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 12:09)
FLAGG:
You've proven my point, i.e. reading is NOT comprehending. I never said that the Falkland Islands were a threat to Britain. Please reread my post which clarified that point......for the last time.
Thank you.
And, in the King's English, my retortds are made with sarcasm, NOT anger....fairly obvious to some. BIAM's comments are made out of anger and I intend to 'shake' him out of that mode. A little prompting fro, the 'gang' might help.
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 12:12)
TCHOCK
Pls reread post....please try to understand this time around.
<<<You've been 'had' again. In English---all of the above is WRONG.
Mechanical, Electrical, Chemical and Nuclear engineering degrees are attained in 4-5 years of college----period, end of sentence. A masters degree is an additional year, followed by three more years for a doctorate (Ph.D).>>>
???????????????
To repeat, there is a woeful scarcity of trade schools in America. And what you wrote is one of the reasons that exists. People are afraid of their shadows in that they will be labelled by a moronic do-gooder if they even suggest a poor performer (heaven help us if it is a minority) is given an opportunity to learn a valuable trade. And where did I say that simeone interested in Shakespeare should not be afforded the opportunity (there is that word again) to enjoy his writing either in or out of school. I am not meaning to sound like BIAM, but please try to read more carefully. You might notice that I am not saying OR inferring that you are a dimwit AND an idiot because you inadvertantly overlooked what I wrote.
Again, I am not sure than an18 year old either here or in England is much of an expert on higher education. While it has been many years since I finished Graduate School, I have put three sons through professional schools and have been paying (through the nose) for educational expenses for years. And, even as stupid as BIAM thinks that I am, I am still versed on the status of higher education in this country. You might be a little more discriminating with the info you are given/provided....especially on the internet.
The best to you.
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 12:50)
Oh I understand fully what you are saying.
I just find it infuriating that you can simply
ignore another point of view which may differ from yours
even if it is the most simplist. That is what is do difficult to understand, lv2read.
< And where did I say that simeone interested in Shakespeare should not be afforded the opportunity (there is that word again) to enjoy his writing either in or out of school>
perhaps if YOU think a bit more about what i said, you might be able to realise that i was making a point about society in general. Over here it's all *pass exams* & very few find out what they really enjoy doing until later in life. THAT was what was implied, lv2read.
I did not overlook anything you said.
An eighteen year old may not know the financial hardships of putting kids through universities, but well I'm pretty damn sure I know most of the standard factual information. Would you not have rather have allowed your three sons to go to a Public (state school) with the same quality of teaching etc?? Through taxes you would already have paid for it........... & the benefits would be available to all.............
Oh yes. By the way, I don't live in England......England is not Britain. I live in Scotland. It is another country from England - we have our own parliament & laws. United Kingdom is what incorporates England, Scotland, Wales & Northern Ireland.
"You might be a little more discriminating with the info you are given/provided.... especially on the internet."
Oh yes, I agree - I don't automatically believe anything I hear on Fox news. ;)
Ok - maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong - maybe it is different in the state in which this girl lives. Maybe - just maybe - you could politely say "oh, really? I always thought it was...etc... in fact I think this girl may have got her facts wrong." Instead of accusing the girl of blatant lying to try & make a fool of me or as you suggested that it was all a big leftie conspiracy against the President & that is why she LIED about the educational system. You know, people get facts wrong all the time. It's inevitable. Sometimes people know more than you, lv2read, sometimes they might have infomation that you don't know about - sometime, lv2read - they might be right....................
& I'm not saying that your right/wrong on this matter - but it's blatant that you are like this all the time with anyone who disagrees with you.
Yes - there is a bad reputation for engineers & such like. Many people believe we're just a bunch of glorified sparkies (electricians). Yes there needs to be more emphasis on Trade & Tech schools as you call them.
Now give me five opportunites in American that I cannot have in this country.
>>By Tchock (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 13:22)
TCHOCK
1. Much, much lower taxation.
2. The consumers have much more disposable income here.
3. A MUCH greater variety of goods and services here. (Note: Not long ago I was in a Marks & Spence (sp?) in Linerpool and was shopping for a deoderant bar/stick. There were five brands from which to choose....in excess of twenty here. Note: Exited the M2 to gas up and buy lunch....the menu had a very, very poor selection. Stayed at the Grovenor in Chester and ordered a roast beef sandwich....only to find that I didn't get a SLICE of beef, but a sliver.
4. It is easy to hire labor in the USA....a pro business attitude.
5. Cities offer me incentives and tax breaks to relocate---they welcome business.
6. In the US, transportation is relatively inexpensive which facilitates business expansion.
7. The reasonable cost of a higher education---and an excess of scholarships available----many go unclaimed.
8. Automobiles....incredible selection of automobiles available...and gas stations on every corner....everywhere. Everyone has the opportunity to find the car of his/her choice.....no waiting...no special ordering.
9. Opportunity breeds optimism...American in general are very optimistic. We have an underclass here for sure, but they live better than the massses that I observed while in Liverpool.
10. The Newport Peninsula has approx 1500 homes which range in price from $2,000,000 to $15-20,000,000. And the most amazing thing is that the average age of the homeowner is 31. You can accomplish whatever you want in Newport. It is an environment of 'can do' 'make it happen' mentality'. It is wholly up to you. Wealth and opportunity galore. People come here and thrive....and most aren't my age but much younger.
11. Jobs, jobs and more jobs. Can you get the Classified ads for the Sunday Los Angeles Times newspaper on the web? You won't believe what you see!!
12. Let's see, I've covered jobs, quality of life, education, housing and there are many more. If you are really interested, Flork me and I'll provide additional data.
>>By lv2read (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 14:11)
<1. Much, much lower taxation.>
Would you be prepared to pay higher taxes if you got an N.H.S & better system wide education????//
<2. The consumers have much more disposable income here.>
Hmmm. Depends. It is all down to the individual I suppose & what line of work they are in. But the less tax you pay the more you've got to spend - so.....
<3. A MUCH greater variety of goods and services here. (Note: Not long ago I was in a Marks & Spence (sp?) in Linerpool and was shopping for a deoderant bar/stick. There were five brands from which to choose....in excess of twenty here. Note: Exited the M2 to gas up and buy lunch....the menu had a very, very poor selection. Stayed at the Grovenor in Chester and ordered a roast beef sandwich....only to find that I didn't get a SLICE of beef, but a sliver.>
Hmmm - greater variety of goods & services in America?? Well I don't know.... but I tend to find that most goods here end up being owned by a select group of companies - I'd guess it would be the same in a lot of other countries as well. Well Marks & Spencer only sells its own brands: there would be only 5 titles to choose from because that was the selection of Marks & Spencer products of Deodrants. There are numerous different (flavours?) of deodrants & perfumes - I would guess it is much the same as the US, but maybe different brand names. Poor Menu selection? I guess - but I have been abroad (Europe) & its the same there. How many menu items would you like???? It also depends on the restaurant you go to how big the menu is & the portions you get. Sometimes you get a huge portion, sometimes you don't. It really depends on the restaurant I guess - & not which country you are in.
<4. It is easy to hire labor in the USA....a pro business attitude.>
Would that be Mexican immigrents? Over here it varies (when the Visa's run out.....)
<5. Cities offer me incentives and tax breaks to relocate---they welcome business.>
To relocate OUT of the city??? Or in???? Why... it seems a bit of a waste of money.......... tax breaks - why don't the government just spend the money on something useful for the community as a whole.
<6. In the US, transportation is relatively inexpensive which facilitates business expansion>
Over here travelling via train can cost you vast amounts of money. I believe quite a lot of business logistics & government transportation has contracts with the First Group (indeed school buses are run by First Student) as well as a public service division which I would imagine is widely used. The First Group actually has its Headquarters in Aberdeen (Scotland) and is a Scottish born company actually.
<7. The reasonable cost of a higher education---and an excess of scholarships available----many go unclaimed.>
Why do many go unclaimed - because its existence is poorly advertised????
Higher Education should have no cost - in an ideal world............ Universities are businesses & that is inherintly wrong.
<8. Automobiles....incredible selection of automobiles available...and gas stations on every corner....everywhere. Everyone has the opportunity to find the car of his/her choice.....no waiting...no special ordering.>
Ok, well Harley Davidsons originated from America so I'll let you off with that one.... BUT I can only imagine that in the US you have a greater need for Gas Guzzlers that do 12 Galleons to the mile or something ridiculous like that. I fail to see how more cars on the road is a GOOD thing.... Everyone here has the opportunity to find the right car here as well - we have all sorts of dealerships. In fact you would not believe how many dealerships there are & as I used to organize a list of all the dealerships in the country including their franchises, I think I know a fair bit about it....
<9. Opportunity breeds optimism...American in general are very optimistic. We have an underclass here for sure, but they live better than the massses that I observed while in Liverpool>
Well if I lived in Liverpool, I'd be pretty depressed so.....
Hmmm optimism? I think 'American Optimism' stems from not knowing the whole truth. I believe the media is the controlling 'class' of society - if you portray a nice happy enviroment then the people will be happy. Hide the truth - & no one will be the wiser. Stalin & his men did the same thing to Russia. Socialist Realism, Censorship, Indoctrination. Nowadays I am sure this is much subtler - but no one can deny the dumming down of society. They do say - ignorance is bliss................
<10. The Newport Peninsula has approx 1500 homes which range in price from $2,000,000 to $15-20,000,000. And the most amazing thing is that the average age of the homeowner is 31. You can accomplish whatever you want in Newport. It is an environment of 'can do' 'make it happen' mentality'. It is wholly up to you. Wealth and opportunity galore. People come here and thrive....and most aren't my age but much younger.>
Wasn't quite sure if you were implying that $2 000 000 for a home was cheap..... That's around £1 000 000 over here - (from the BBC)
Average Cost: £199184 ($400 000). Detached: £300349 ($600 000). Semi-detached: £180170 ($370 000). Terraced: £158493 ($310 000). Flat: £185703 ($380 000)
Wow - looking at this myself, I'm quite shocked. House prices are ridiculously high here - scarily. It's only a matter of time before the whole thing collapses.
Average Age of Homeowners: Male, 38.1; Female, 37
First Time Buyers 35.8% of the new homeowners are first time buyers.
Hmm America beats us in the age factor. What are the mortgages like over there??
<11. Jobs, jobs and more jobs. Can you get the Classified ads for the Sunday Los Angeles Times newspaper on the web? You won't believe what you see!!>
YES !! The LA times does publish its job section online. Ok - 100 000(+) jobs is quite a lot - I'll assume it's only for South Cal?
So far (for accounting) the Salaries look pretty good actually.
Hmmm overall.
I can get a good job here or anywhere else in the world.
I can be just as optimistic here (although when I'm optimistic I'm realistic...)
Yeah - Britain tends to moan a lot I find - but at least we moan - it means we realise something's not right. We might not do anything about it - mostly, but moaning is the first step to getting up off your ass & doing something (one would like to hope).
Portion control - well...that has nothing to do with what country you are in, really. "Never mind the quality feel the width"????? (Well... good restaurants are sometimes hard to come by....)
Optimism comes from a truely healthy (not only physical) population or one that has been dummed down & censored to the brink that it is perocial (sp?) & so blind to the news that it is given that it feels like it is the best country in the world. "Millions truly believed that Russia was the most advanced country in the world in all respects," Volkogonov (Russian Historian). I see no reason why the same is not applied here.......... it's just less obvious - unless there are secret government run camps in the middle of nowhere & people disappear from their beds during the night after they've just announced they'd rather vote "for the other guy"????
I'm sure America is a really nice country - I would like to go there actually - maybe I will even have the OPPORTUNITY to study there in later university years. I mean after all the weather's nicer there than it is in this bloody awful climate.
Hmmm......... thank you for giving me the information by the way :)
>>By Tchock (Friday, 29 Sep 2006 18:00)
L2R, have you ever given any thought whatsoever to the idea that maybe other people's experience of America is different from your own?
>>By Flagg (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 11:02)
FLAGG
I've travelled extensively in the US, and read two newspapers daily, and have a graduate level degree in Mechanical Engineering from a very selective University, and own and operate a successful medium sized business. I believe that I am aware of differences in opinions, both here and elsewhere.....but to suggest that I wear blinders is pretty silly. I am unabashedly proud of my country, my President, and am certain that I reside in 'the' land of opportunity. And I have taken advantage of those opportunities.
Tchock's statements/questions on education in America were unsettling. The education is out there, but the individuals and their families are responsible for taking advantage of it. We don't pay teachers here to be babysitters.
Perhaps this is ignorance on my part, but I believe that European education--complete with austerity exams--is superior to our system. But pass or fail would never fly here because they (those standards) would be deemed racist.....when in fact they would be a very good thing. Those exams could redirect poor performers to trade schools wherein they could acquire skills which would lead to a more financially secure future. The caliber of German students in the Gymnasium (sp?) is so superior to the majority of our students--practically unbelievable. Flagg, you would not believe just how lame our 'average' student is. But the education is free, available, etc....yet its value exists ONLY if one pursues the learning opportunities offerresd.
Does this make any sense, or have I confounded you? It is really difficult the state of American education in100 words or less!!! But, I have tried.
>>By lv2read (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 12:08)
I wasn't talking only about education but...
Ok, had it occurred to you that it's not possible for everyone to take advantage of that education? Is it so hard for you to believe that some people can't manage like you did? And no, I'm not talking about poor people or black people or the children of single mothers, I'm talking about the people who, quite simply, would rather not be here on this shithole of a planet. I know these people exist because I'm one of them. I am not a capable person, I am a confused, lazy, depressing cliche of a person, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. It's easy for you to say everything is ok when the only thing you want out of life is money and cars, but some of us don't want anything out of life. For some of us all those opportunities you keep talking about aren't opportunities at all, they're just irritations.
So what I'm saying is, you're completely self-centred and I think you should stop judging the rest of the world by your standards, you should try and get out of this ''I'm happy so why the hell isn't everyone else'' mentality.
I don't expect you to understand of course, I fully expect you to a) mention my age in an insulting way, b) tell me I need therapy or some such bullshit and b) go completely off-topic and probably bring President Bush into it.
>>By Flagg (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 12:53)
c)*
>>By Flagg (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 12:54)
"The wailings above confirm my belief that America's system is best. Does British education come down to pounds and no cents!!??"
"Perhaps this is ignorance on my part, but I believe that European education--complete with austerity exams--is superior to our system."
make up your mind will you L2R!!
>>By BushisaManiac (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 18:29)
BIAM
What??????? America's education is not tainted because there are those whi are lazy, don't give a shit, that won't try, etc. The German system weeds out those malcontents and they educate the most prepared, the most competent, the most worthy pf the lot.
FLAGG
I don't think that my response/advice to you would be any didfferent than which your parents (most probably) have offerred. If you avidly look for the negative, you'll see it!! And regarding therapy, perhaps you are in denial. Do you think that your point of view is conducive to responsible productive citizenship?? Let me guess?? You have no desire to be a contributing member of society, Right? Well, I believe that wasting ones pottential is morally wrong, and that laziness (expecting something for nothing, is wrong. And, in view of the things written above, I can clearly see why you would be resentful of me. America, the land of opportunity, would be a major irritation for you because there are no free rides here compared with what you have in England....you are much better off where you are.
>>By lv2read (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 19:35)
It seems to me L2R that you have no real views of your own, you jump into discussions on any subject mention one or two things about that subject then turn it into a propoganda speech on how good the US of A is, how fair democratic, free and wonderfull it all is over the pond how wonderful your muppet president is, then you change your view of the subject you hijacked and go quiet for a while...
do us all a favour next time you wish to discuss a subject dont turn it into a crusade for US appreciation, we all have our opinion of the states those of us that have been there or not (and i have) and I doubt severely whether your input here will change our opinions, this last discussion for example was whether paying for education was right or wrong and whether uni students should be subsidised by the government or made to pay back and student grants and loans, suddenly you pop along, dont give your views on either of these subjects, just on how good the US school system was, rant on about it calling people commies and idiots along the way and then in the last say how good the european education system is....
We all know you love the states, we all know you idolise Bush...can you not just join in a discussion about the subject matter in hand without mentioning these loves of yours...... or do you do it on purpose is that what gives you kicks!!
we moan about our politicians, we moan about our government services but dont get the impression that we want to change them for yours!!
>>By BushisaManiac (Saturday, 30 Sep 2006 19:41)
>I don't think that my response/advice to you would be any didfferent than which your parents (most probably) have offerred.
There you go again. Assuming you know what my parents think. They could be dead for all you know.
>If you avidly look for the negative, you'll see it!!
Actually, I look for the positive, and I do see it, in abundance. But when I think about my future, everything positive seems futile.
>Let me guess?? You have no desire to be a contributing member of society, Right?
Bingo. Why should I?
>Well, I believe that wasting ones pottential is morally wrong, and that laziness (expecting something for nothing, is wrong.
You wanted an apostrophe in ''ones'' mate.
And of course you believe everyone has potential. I see now. Everyone has potential and if a person doesn't make something of their life it's because they wasted that potential, because they didn't try hard enough.
I don't expect something for nothing. I don't expect anything, and I thought I'd made that clear in my little outburst of nihilism earlier. But ''something for nothing'' is a phrase you seem to like using, so you used it.
>America, the land of opportunity, would be a major irritation for you because there are no free rides here compared with what you have in England
Right. Of course, I'd just LOVE the life of a dole bum. Getting up first thing in the afternoon every day, watching daytime tv, playing video games and going down the dole office.
No, I want a job. I want to EARN a living, I want to do something. The fact that there is no job I know of that I could imagine being satisfying to me is what worries me.
L2R, you talk about opportunity and the rewards of hard work, but I think really you're just talking about yourself. You've put the work in and got where you wanted to be, you've got your successful medium-size business and your Bentley and your cash, and now you get pissed off at other people for not being as successful as you. Or maybe it's that not everyone wants the same things you do.
You're just self-centred. Not in a mean way or anything, it seems like you genuinely can't comprehend that not everyone is like you.
>>By Flagg (Sunday, 1 Oct 2006 00:14)
I'm sorry, I meant
assuming you know what my parents most probably think.
You don't.
>>By Flagg (Sunday, 1 Oct 2006 00:14)
Oh, I missed this part.
>And regarding therapy, perhaps you are in denial.
I am not. I have had therapy and it was very useful, but it didn't cure me of my critical case of not being lv2read.
>>By Flagg (Sunday, 1 Oct 2006 00:16)
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